078 When The Job Advice Runs Out

Job search can be a challenging and rewarding experience. When you learn new techniques and try them out, some may work others might not.

What happens when you get to the point when you have tried everything. Nothing seems to be working! Don’t miss this episode where Scott and Andrew discuss strategies to invigorate your search.

Don’t miss these Topics:

  • Taking in and evaluating the advice you are receiving.
  • What to do when everything you have tried doesn’t work.
  • Mindset and activities that can support or defeat your efforts.

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00:00:01 – 00:05:04

welcome to job seekers radio. I’m Andrew and I’m Scott. This production is meant to provide you the listener meaningful support defined great careers faster. And that’s whether you’re working or not. Today’s episode is brought to you by the anatomy of a networking conversation. It’s an e book a Free Resource. We have for you at job. Seekers radio DOT COM in today’s show. We’re talking about what happens when the advice runs out in your job search and it just doesn’t seem to be working you’re still out there looking haven’t found a job yet I think there was a recent situation that you had Scott. Yes other eager. Probably fill us in with one of your clients right. I was just having the conversation recently with somebody who is not complaining but expressing his frustration with the fact that he has been around the job seeking block for awhile now. He’s relatively new to the area but not new to his field and that industry is represented here in the Portland area. He’s talked to a lot of people. He is very well connected in the right places. He’s received a lot of advice from both of us from others and nothing has worked yet. He’s been working with Everything with from startups to established companies all sizes and shapes and nothing quite has worked out to give him a foothold. Right gainful employment right or at least the final set of interviews or a process. That looks exactly normal. He’s gotten close in a couple of situations but it’s it’s not anything that really has delivered anything even even a temporary contract position and I’ve been there a lot of what he was describing was stuff that I lived through during my years of unemployment. And so I. I had a great deal of compassion for him under these circumstances because he’s truly frustrated. He’s tried everything he is. At least his last job was at a higher level so we talked about the fact that there. Aren’t that many jobs in this metropolitan area on that level in the field and we talked about his efforts to branch out. He’s looking at at companies of different sizes. He has applied for jobs of at Lower Levels. And when he he is then asked why he’s applying for a lower position because he’s now over qualified and you can’t get a job when you’re overqualified which doesn’t really make any sense. Other than the fact that the a lot of companies are too afraid to hire someone that they’re then they feel they then have to replace. Because they’re gonNA move onto something else when I talked to. Hr PEOPLE WHO Express that fear. I also tell them well. What are the chances that they may be able to help your company move up within your company that would be a really great higher? Then there’s there’s fear in Balkh he’s been at this for a number of months. He’s in a situation where he has a family to support. And what do you do that? The one thing that I keep coming back to is keep going. And that’s really the the answer to the question keep going. Yeah and it’s nothing that we can’t work with and the challenge that a lot of people have is they come into a situation and they put a date out there. I don’t know if you’ve ever done this but I should have a new job by this date doing what I did where I came from. And now I’m putting all these undo Stresses on myself that are forced and and one of the things. We’re talking about. Today is the advice. Where is the advice coming from? It comes in different forms. How I process the advice and take an internalized. What’s good for me versus what’s actually worked for somebody else right well. You’re you’re mentioning the the stress. That comes with those deadlines at times. Those deadlines are real. I think of the guy that both of us know who was looking for an hr a learning and development position. Who has money was running out my give a date. At least where he had drawn the line in terms of his comfort zone and I have a friend down in Los Angeles who was in exactly the same situation where he was going into his long-term savings because his unemployment had lasted a lot longer. The expected there are times when that deadline is real. But it doesn’t mean that it’s always as hard as you think it might be one of the things during my unemployment. That resonated with me was the idea that nothing is permanent. And when you’re thinking when you’re at the bottom of the well so to speak that you feel like you fallen into when you got laid off or otherwise became unemployed.

00:05:04 – 00:10:02

How how can you see the end when it feels so dark and deep and the fact is and it’s a fact nothing lasts forever? There is a day that you will be employed again and as difficult as it feels when you start telling yourself that. Wow I must be unemployable if I can’t get that job that’s not. The truth is just the story. We start to tell ourselves because we don’t have a better answer because everybody else’s so lucky where I they’ve found the job and I didn’t so there must be something wrong with me. Something wrong with the process or the activities. I’m participating in and all the advice that you give Should be considered a suggestion rather than. Hey this is something you ought to go. Do you know the only people I know do this. And are successful right. And that’s another thing that drives me crazy sometimes about these books that that people are selling. Oh this is the way to success. This is the only way right to success and even a dollar sign attached to it. Yes that’s the only way for reminds me of the story. We’ve heard years ago about send in one dollar for the advice on how to get rich and you put that advertising out to the whole world and if everybody sends you a dollar you become rich. That’s the point it sort of the same thing with these self. Help books that you read. You’ve got to take all of this stuff with a grain of salt because what they’re telling you is what worked for them and that’s great. If the advice you receive works for you. That’s great so now it works for two people. Maybe it works for ten people or maybe even a hundred people but it is never going work for everyone by the same token the advice. That doesn’t work for anybody. Hell I work. It will work for at least one person to your point. Used these suggestions if it’s something you have tried. And this was part of my conversation with another friend of mine who is currently employed but looking to get out of a toxic situation and not feeling like he’s getting any traction the idea is okay so something that maybe had a little bit of success for your showed some hope. What can you do that? It’s just slightly different following the same basic principles of the things that don’t work for you. Is there anything you can learn from that process that you’re going to take with you as you do something different so that you can then tell the story of what worked for you when it lands the point is you have to keep going in order to try something different right and that comes down to mindset we talk a lot about mindset here and what I’m hearing is hey these people haven’t mindset that I doing all those things? And here’s the result expected in. I’m not getting that result. Was that valid result to expect and maybe adjusting the mindset to say hey I expect that everything I do should lead to an interview. Let’s just use that as an example if I if I do. Networking is that leading to an interview. In how many networking do I need to do right? So this is my political pragmatic. Mind thinking that if I have a mindset that says I need to talk to ten people a day in order to get this and I don’t get this and I need to see what I’m doing here that’s wrong or needs adjustment or is that you know an effective measure to get that expected outcome exactly. And you’re really touching on something that we also talked about on the past but I want to bring up again. It’s the idea of expectations. Can we approach our activities whether it’s networking the conference other conversations that we’re having can we approach these things and do these things without a specific expectation and simply being open to what it might bring and this actually ties back to the example of the first guy that we were talking about? He’s trying not to have specific expectations. But simply being open to whatever comes from the conversations. He’s having and I think in his situation. You just had an expectation. Though well it it’s it’s more of it open to something. Openness is more of the mindset or talking about then an actual expectation of a specific result. Because he’s not saying I’m going to have X. result what he needs is a job. He’s approaching these different conversations. I think from a pretty healthy perspective of saying okay. Let’s just see what because he’s made that adjustment? Yes you’re saying is that his expectation may be. Hey this conversation is gonna lead directly to a job and when that didn’t happen adjust expectations. Sure Right. I think that’s a reasonable until his expectations are now tailored to the conversation.

00:10:02 – 00:15:05

He’s having or the situation he’s in and then he saying okay. I’m open now that this conversation may just lead to another conversation or it may lead to nothing or but he’s been doing this for awhile now that he’s starting to feel frustrated because it’s not landing anything or at least not something that’s actually bringing in the money to support his family which. I totally understand that. That was not a static situation dynamic in so if I see my my my savings by resources might assets going like this better. Be doing more stuff on this side or to get something to backfill that that Burn rate. How do you answer that right? It was he had going. I can’t answer that he right. And that’s why we we seek advice from other people is to get different perspectives to say okay. I think this is something I should give a shot. And that’s really what we encourage all of our listeners to do. Just give it a shot. And I also think about those that we’ve heard at the breakfast club and some of the other Networking opportunities where someone will bring up an idea and they say oh well. We’ve tried that. Well how about this l? No I tried that too and had six years ago even has earned. No but the idea is okay. How could you do the same thing but differently? You know the same idea. Change it up somehow too often our frustration and disappointment. Keep us from trying something just a little bit differently because I totally understand. We don’t Wanna waste our time. I don’t want to waste my time either. Trust me I get that. Is it a waste of time? If you’re doing it differently when you think about the evolution of species it’s not suddenly they grow a whole new set of limbs that takes a long time and it’s one little mutation after another if you approach a job search similarly to say if I if I do the same basic things but I’m going to tweak it just a little bit on this chromosome what’s going to be different. The exploration then can bring its own value. Its own energy where you’re not focusing on. Oh I have to have this end result now if you keep doing that. It’s really not getting you anywhere. Why can you do? That’s bigger? That may change things up automatically. You’re still coming back to the same idea that you have to keep going. You can’t just stop because then you’re guaranteed not to get right. Well it’s much like I don’t like to use football. Analogy is very often if you look at the Kansas City chiefs this season they. They’re starting quarterback went out for a part of the season and so they had to put a new guy in. We can’t keep running the same plays with the new quarterback that maybe doesn’t have the same skills as the other quarterback you have to make an adjustment and so they they ran different plays while he was filling in for the injured quarterback happening that he. I think he won. Four out of five games or something. Because the coach had enough sense to counsel his people to let’s run. These plays a different way. Let’s come up with a different set of place and see if these work that you’ve just rang a bell in my head with that were having conversations with one of my corporate clients specifically about deploying your people against their strengths because ultimately people are far more engaged when they’re doing things that they’re already good at or things that they’re already passionate about so if you are adjusting those plays on the new guy strengths. And you’re getting good results. Think about the morale boost. That has well. The same thing is going to be true in job. Search whether you’re employed or not you are going to have a unique set of strengths. Your skills are going to be a little bit different from the person who’s advice you’re receiving. So how do you more the advice into something? That is actually going to employ your strengths. Because they’re going to be different from everyone else that you’re talking to It’s not like you hang up your strengths and your weaknesses and everything in the closet to job search. You Know I. It’s you have to look at part of the networking piece. Do you think your strengths will play two and the other parts. Maybe you don’t leverage those as much right and Because I’ve seen a lot of people who are expressive and the networking is really easy for them. But the other person doesn’t have a chance to talk. And that doesn’t go anywhere until it. So we’ve talked about styles preferences really knowing your style preference or your strengths is going to help you do some of the things. So that’s how I would morph it. I would say I’m Gonna more of this thing that you know. Networking is kind of a expressive right and External what they call it in extroverted extrovert.

00:15:05 – 00:20:18

That’s what it is if your personality is such that you’re going to thrive in that environment by all means jump into it if you’re going to be drained in that environment. I’m not sure it’s a good idea to push yourself to part but this comes back to that mindset idea if you know your strength is not getting out and meeting fifteen people in one evening to push yourself to do that may be helpful to some degree to expect the same results as the person who thrives in that environment. I think that it’s fair right. I don’t think that’s a fair expectation for you to set for yourself so instead if you’re looking at the things that you’re hearing from others and comparing what is their skill set. Where are they most comfortable? What is their style preference? Compared to mine I can do the things that we have in common based on our common strengths. And maybe not push myself as hard to do the that. I’m not strong at because if you’re familiar with with strengths finder. You will understand that. You’re not going to make the same kind of progress in those areas. That are not your string right so instead of setting yourself up for that kind of failure and then tearing yourself down because you didn’t succeed how about shifting your mindset into focusing on the things that you do well and then you are strong where you are strong for as long as they’re leading to the outcome desirable for Employment. Sure because there’s a universal truth about employment that I’m aware of that. Nothing happens until you have an interview because that’s the thing that immediately precedes offer. Typically okay how do you define the interview? How many there still some sort of measuring stick okay that they used to say okay? You’re the right person. Here’s the offer. Whatever that measuring stick is typically. It’s interview and and so the truth is that an interview is a conversation dialogue. Yes and and the Nice thing about networking. It’s a conversation. It’s a dialogue so it’s prep for an interview so now I’ve changed my mindset. Not that networking is this weird strange thing that I go and I try to convince you to put me in for a job right. I and I practice my interview Skill Sheriff Story Whilst Good Question Have Accommodate Times. Have we talked to people who tell us the story that they were having just a conversation? And it morphed into an interview. It doesn’t happen as often as the formal interviews where a job opening has been posted. You go through the process but it does happen and these things happen for people who are open to them but that is a mindset. It’s not about getting all the advice and something clicks necessarily. Sometimes that happens a lot of times. That happens that’s not the story for everyone. The story that does work is that it is going to change. I need unfortunately even the good times don’t last forever. The bad times don’t last forever. You will find the job or a job that is going to be better than your current situation. Things will get better. It does get better and what I heard here. Today is a couple of things as a job seeker. Somebody that’s even employed looking for something better always be tooling up on the job seeking cy agree and do some learning there. Find out how to write the great resume how to do a good interview. Always be tooling up on that side of things so that you never run into a position where we decide. I’m not gonna take anymore advice because it’s all up kiss right right. We’re excited you know what this advice thing is not for me. I’m just going to do what I think is good which isn’t bad but then. I’m not taking other new information. So then what if the market changes now? I’m in a bad position. So that’s the first thing. The second thing is the mindset I would have for networking as a suggestion that you might want to run through your filter. Right is I want to identify an ideal and that is I wanna find an interview or a conversation that Morse into an interview. And I’m going to keep doing this thing until I find one of those and so that’s Kinda like motivation to keep going. Which is something we’re talking about here is keep going well. I’m going to keep going until I find that I’m coming back to a one of these conversations that we’ve mentioned before. Just how do you keep going when you haven’t found it yet? There there comes a period when you get tired right. You’ve tried all the job search fatigue. Right take arrest. It’s okay pending on how badly you need the the income that may determine how long the rest happens. Fine rests where you can so that you have the energy to keep going. Don’t stop just because you’re not getting traction doesn’t mean you shouldn’t keep trying to to to more this to do something a little bit differently but to keep using the advice that you’ve you’ve received so far it is going to be different dependent upon what level of position you’ve had in the past and what how much of that might be in your specific market.

00:20:18 – 00:23:31

It’s going to be a little different for everyone. What doesn’t change is that? It is not permanent. And you have to keep going until you decide not to work anymore right right. If you’re deploying where you could do that I guess you could but the idea is. Hey you know what even if I have something? That’s good for me now. Does it mean it’ll be good for me in five years? Oh that’s learn to write or or even ten years and it’s the people that I coach that have been in the same company for Twenty Twenty five thirty years that come out and are like I never thought this would happen to me right and I can just tell you when I see the look on their face. I don’t want to see it out in anybody’s face so I’ll give you the free advice here. Take it for what? It’s worth reading through your filter right as a suggestion. Don’t ever think anything as permanent and always be looking not that you’re looking to leave not that you don’t Wanna stay at that. You’re open to opportunities for market research. Think about blockbuster us what’s that The video heavy right. Yeah no but your point. So there were all sorts of indicators suggest that the market was changing around them the employees who have been in any company for twenty five years if they’re not doing the market research to see where the trends are going and whether or not they have the skills for the newer kind of work that’s happening that’s a gap and that’s something that we talk about in my field about. Skilling up and making sure that people are ready with the skills that they are going to need for the next iteration of the job they currently have. These are things that everyone can be working on a constant level. Keep Looking. It isn’t about getting out of your current job especially if you love your current job and you wanna stay in it. Knowing what’s out there will help you in your current job. It comes back to the idea of keep going. Keep doing the things that you you feel. You need to be doing to survive. What can you do a little bit differently to find? Better outcome. Better Opportunity writer outcome. Keep swinging So that does it for this episode of Job Seekers Radio you can find all the show notes and Resources Job Seekers radio DOT COM FORWARD SLASH. Zero seven eight. Thank you for joining us for this episode of Job Seekers Radio Your investment of time and attention is truly appreciated. Head on over to itunes. In fact there’s a link in the show notes to take you right to itunes and it really be helpful for us if you would actually do a rate and review a so that we can get some feedback to make this better production for you and also to spread the word about Job Seekers Radio. We also want your comments and questions. We love to answer those. We do episodes periodically to answer a listener questions. So please send us a few more. We love getting those. Well I’m Andrew and I’m Scott and in the words of Tracy McMillan. Everything works out in the end if it has worked out yet that it’s not the end by everybody stay in the game.

Anatomy of a Networking Conversation

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